Being a persistent or persevering learner?
If someone is studying something for a longer period, concentrated, focused: is he rather a "persistent learner" (which yields more hits at google) or a "persevering learner" (which seem to be used more often in bible references and on religious websites)?
According to @Thursagen's answer, persevering would be the positive notion.
word-usage usage
New contributor
add a comment |
If someone is studying something for a longer period, concentrated, focused: is he rather a "persistent learner" (which yields more hits at google) or a "persevering learner" (which seem to be used more often in bible references and on religious websites)?
According to @Thursagen's answer, persevering would be the positive notion.
word-usage usage
New contributor
Related: Difference between “persistence” and “perseverance"
– scohe001
Dec 31 '18 at 17:27
add a comment |
If someone is studying something for a longer period, concentrated, focused: is he rather a "persistent learner" (which yields more hits at google) or a "persevering learner" (which seem to be used more often in bible references and on religious websites)?
According to @Thursagen's answer, persevering would be the positive notion.
word-usage usage
New contributor
If someone is studying something for a longer period, concentrated, focused: is he rather a "persistent learner" (which yields more hits at google) or a "persevering learner" (which seem to be used more often in bible references and on religious websites)?
According to @Thursagen's answer, persevering would be the positive notion.
word-usage usage
word-usage usage
New contributor
New contributor
New contributor
asked Dec 31 '18 at 9:06
kalle
1185
1185
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New contributor
Related: Difference between “persistence” and “perseverance"
– scohe001
Dec 31 '18 at 17:27
add a comment |
Related: Difference between “persistence” and “perseverance"
– scohe001
Dec 31 '18 at 17:27
Related: Difference between “persistence” and “perseverance"
– scohe001
Dec 31 '18 at 17:27
Related: Difference between “persistence” and “perseverance"
– scohe001
Dec 31 '18 at 17:27
add a comment |
4 Answers
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I'd say a diligent, or hardworking student.
EDIT: I'm a US American, and learner is a funny word --- I can't tell you offhand what the rule is, but it appears in sentences like "He's a slow learner". When I Google for "learner", Google responds with "a fast learner", which is ok too. So in my opinion, learner/student is one of those word pairs where they're each used in slightly different situations.
Similar to how in the US, student driver is far more common, and in the UK, it's learner driver.
New contributor
Johnny, this doesn't answer the question, which is about persistent vs persevering - there's no request for alternatives. It's important to read the question carefully before attempting an answer. For further guidance, see How to Answer. :-)
– Chappo
Dec 31 '18 at 23:35
1
Thanks @Chappo I'll check that out. Yeah, I'm answering the bigger implied question and what I think the OP needs to know: "If someone is studying something for a longer period..." And I'd hate to give advice about learner when that's not even idiomatic in the first place, yet we all give the impression that it is.
– Johnny
Dec 31 '18 at 23:38
How is learner not "idiomatic". If I'm learning to drive a car, I'm called a learner. If I have some difficulties I must overcome (say, a disability) but I diligently persist and persevere, why is it not appropriate for my driving instructor to describe me as a persistent [or persevering] learner to differentiate me from those who don't persist (i.e. who give up)?
– Chappo
Jan 1 at 0:09
1
@Chappo: I agree with Johnny. According to Google, "student" is about 20 times more common than "learner". In the US, the standard term for somebody who is learning to drive a car is "student driver".
– Scott
Jan 1 at 1:08
2
Here in Canada, most lay people would use "student" but "learner" was in common use, among educators and educational theorists a while back. It's a useful distinction. A student may be no more than someone occupying a chair in a classroom, while a learner is, by definition learning.
– Al Maki
2 days ago
|
show 2 more comments
Between the two options presented, "persistent learner" sounds more natural to me but has some slight connotations that make it less than ideal. In particular, persistence and perseverance when applied to people typically mean "continuing despite adversity". In other words, rather than generally being "somebody who works hard at studying" a persistent learner is specifically "somebody who has a hard time studying but does so anyway", or "somebody who spends a lot of time studying because they need more time to learn the same amount".
If you want to describe someone who studies a lot or works hard at it, the best adjective would be "studious". "Studious learner" is a bit redundant though, if you're combining with a noun like "learner" that already implies that studying is being done then the adjective "diligent" is better, with the best phrase I can think of being "diligent student" assuming that the person is in fact a student.
add a comment |
"Persistent" vs "Perservering" refers to two different kinds of adversity.
"Persistent" is for ordinary adversity, like partying or romantic distractions.
"Perservering" means extraordinary or overwhelming adversity, like oppression or discrimination.
- Santa Cruz has a reputation as a party school, but Kate was a persistent student - never missing a class and carrying a 4.0 average.
- Leads on the case were few and far between, but Hercule Poirot was nothing if not persistent."
- None of the women on the science team were taken seriously - yet they proved to be the better scientists; they had each perservered through worse simply to get here.
- The German doomed their nuclear program, having long decried the science as "Jewish physics", and directing SS inquisitions against those who perservered in its study.
Your explanation makes a lot of sense and the examples are useful, but I'm reluctant to upvote your answer because you've included no evidence to support it - it currently stands as just a personal opinion, and how can we tell if you're misinformed? Can you add some dictionary definitions or other authoritative references to confirm your interpretation? Happy to upvote if you do... :-)
– Chappo
Dec 31 '18 at 23:44
@chappo at your request...
– Harper
Jan 1 at 0:09
According to MW's definition, persevere means "to persist ... in spite of counterinfluences, opposition, or discouragement" - not quite "extraordinary or overwhelming adversity", although the extreme is necessarily part of the range. I think your analysis is correct in its direction but poor in its expression. I'll upvote as promised, but you could garner upvotes from others with a further revision...
– Chappo
Jan 1 at 0:20
add a comment |
Somebody seems to have coined the phrase 'persistent learner', but persistent is normally used when someone keeps on doing something undesirable, like a child pestering a parent for sweets, or in a phrase like 'persistent cough'.
OK, the dictionary definition doesn't specify a negative implication, though an old (1934) edition of the Concise Oxford in my possession defines persist as Continue firmly or obstinately (in opinion, course, doing) esp. against remonstrance &c.
To my way of thinking, you persist in a bad course, persevere in a good one.
So 'persistent learner' can be used in a positive way, even though 'persistent' per se is usually rather negative?
– kalle
Dec 31 '18 at 14:04
4
I would have to disagree your interpretation of 'persistent'. As far as I can tell there's no negative implication to what the person is attempting.
– bxk21
Dec 31 '18 at 14:40
2
-1 I agree with @bxk21 on this one--your definition of persistent being "normally used when someone keeps on doing something undesirable" is simply untrue. Persistent only means that someone is working against opposition, setbacks or failure. Whether that opposition be deserved or not has nothing to do with the word. Perhaps you could edit the answer to include why you believe what you say to be true?
– scohe001
Dec 31 '18 at 17:05
I don't see the connection between "pester" and "persist." Can you provide other negative uses of "persistent"?
– TheFontSnob
Dec 31 '18 at 19:30
I didn't say there was a connection between 'pester' and 'persist', I just used that example of a person being persistent..
– Kate Bunting
2 days ago
add a comment |
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4 Answers
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I'd say a diligent, or hardworking student.
EDIT: I'm a US American, and learner is a funny word --- I can't tell you offhand what the rule is, but it appears in sentences like "He's a slow learner". When I Google for "learner", Google responds with "a fast learner", which is ok too. So in my opinion, learner/student is one of those word pairs where they're each used in slightly different situations.
Similar to how in the US, student driver is far more common, and in the UK, it's learner driver.
New contributor
Johnny, this doesn't answer the question, which is about persistent vs persevering - there's no request for alternatives. It's important to read the question carefully before attempting an answer. For further guidance, see How to Answer. :-)
– Chappo
Dec 31 '18 at 23:35
1
Thanks @Chappo I'll check that out. Yeah, I'm answering the bigger implied question and what I think the OP needs to know: "If someone is studying something for a longer period..." And I'd hate to give advice about learner when that's not even idiomatic in the first place, yet we all give the impression that it is.
– Johnny
Dec 31 '18 at 23:38
How is learner not "idiomatic". If I'm learning to drive a car, I'm called a learner. If I have some difficulties I must overcome (say, a disability) but I diligently persist and persevere, why is it not appropriate for my driving instructor to describe me as a persistent [or persevering] learner to differentiate me from those who don't persist (i.e. who give up)?
– Chappo
Jan 1 at 0:09
1
@Chappo: I agree with Johnny. According to Google, "student" is about 20 times more common than "learner". In the US, the standard term for somebody who is learning to drive a car is "student driver".
– Scott
Jan 1 at 1:08
2
Here in Canada, most lay people would use "student" but "learner" was in common use, among educators and educational theorists a while back. It's a useful distinction. A student may be no more than someone occupying a chair in a classroom, while a learner is, by definition learning.
– Al Maki
2 days ago
|
show 2 more comments
I'd say a diligent, or hardworking student.
EDIT: I'm a US American, and learner is a funny word --- I can't tell you offhand what the rule is, but it appears in sentences like "He's a slow learner". When I Google for "learner", Google responds with "a fast learner", which is ok too. So in my opinion, learner/student is one of those word pairs where they're each used in slightly different situations.
Similar to how in the US, student driver is far more common, and in the UK, it's learner driver.
New contributor
Johnny, this doesn't answer the question, which is about persistent vs persevering - there's no request for alternatives. It's important to read the question carefully before attempting an answer. For further guidance, see How to Answer. :-)
– Chappo
Dec 31 '18 at 23:35
1
Thanks @Chappo I'll check that out. Yeah, I'm answering the bigger implied question and what I think the OP needs to know: "If someone is studying something for a longer period..." And I'd hate to give advice about learner when that's not even idiomatic in the first place, yet we all give the impression that it is.
– Johnny
Dec 31 '18 at 23:38
How is learner not "idiomatic". If I'm learning to drive a car, I'm called a learner. If I have some difficulties I must overcome (say, a disability) but I diligently persist and persevere, why is it not appropriate for my driving instructor to describe me as a persistent [or persevering] learner to differentiate me from those who don't persist (i.e. who give up)?
– Chappo
Jan 1 at 0:09
1
@Chappo: I agree with Johnny. According to Google, "student" is about 20 times more common than "learner". In the US, the standard term for somebody who is learning to drive a car is "student driver".
– Scott
Jan 1 at 1:08
2
Here in Canada, most lay people would use "student" but "learner" was in common use, among educators and educational theorists a while back. It's a useful distinction. A student may be no more than someone occupying a chair in a classroom, while a learner is, by definition learning.
– Al Maki
2 days ago
|
show 2 more comments
I'd say a diligent, or hardworking student.
EDIT: I'm a US American, and learner is a funny word --- I can't tell you offhand what the rule is, but it appears in sentences like "He's a slow learner". When I Google for "learner", Google responds with "a fast learner", which is ok too. So in my opinion, learner/student is one of those word pairs where they're each used in slightly different situations.
Similar to how in the US, student driver is far more common, and in the UK, it's learner driver.
New contributor
I'd say a diligent, or hardworking student.
EDIT: I'm a US American, and learner is a funny word --- I can't tell you offhand what the rule is, but it appears in sentences like "He's a slow learner". When I Google for "learner", Google responds with "a fast learner", which is ok too. So in my opinion, learner/student is one of those word pairs where they're each used in slightly different situations.
Similar to how in the US, student driver is far more common, and in the UK, it's learner driver.
New contributor
edited 2 days ago
New contributor
answered Dec 31 '18 at 10:05
Johnny
1706
1706
New contributor
New contributor
Johnny, this doesn't answer the question, which is about persistent vs persevering - there's no request for alternatives. It's important to read the question carefully before attempting an answer. For further guidance, see How to Answer. :-)
– Chappo
Dec 31 '18 at 23:35
1
Thanks @Chappo I'll check that out. Yeah, I'm answering the bigger implied question and what I think the OP needs to know: "If someone is studying something for a longer period..." And I'd hate to give advice about learner when that's not even idiomatic in the first place, yet we all give the impression that it is.
– Johnny
Dec 31 '18 at 23:38
How is learner not "idiomatic". If I'm learning to drive a car, I'm called a learner. If I have some difficulties I must overcome (say, a disability) but I diligently persist and persevere, why is it not appropriate for my driving instructor to describe me as a persistent [or persevering] learner to differentiate me from those who don't persist (i.e. who give up)?
– Chappo
Jan 1 at 0:09
1
@Chappo: I agree with Johnny. According to Google, "student" is about 20 times more common than "learner". In the US, the standard term for somebody who is learning to drive a car is "student driver".
– Scott
Jan 1 at 1:08
2
Here in Canada, most lay people would use "student" but "learner" was in common use, among educators and educational theorists a while back. It's a useful distinction. A student may be no more than someone occupying a chair in a classroom, while a learner is, by definition learning.
– Al Maki
2 days ago
|
show 2 more comments
Johnny, this doesn't answer the question, which is about persistent vs persevering - there's no request for alternatives. It's important to read the question carefully before attempting an answer. For further guidance, see How to Answer. :-)
– Chappo
Dec 31 '18 at 23:35
1
Thanks @Chappo I'll check that out. Yeah, I'm answering the bigger implied question and what I think the OP needs to know: "If someone is studying something for a longer period..." And I'd hate to give advice about learner when that's not even idiomatic in the first place, yet we all give the impression that it is.
– Johnny
Dec 31 '18 at 23:38
How is learner not "idiomatic". If I'm learning to drive a car, I'm called a learner. If I have some difficulties I must overcome (say, a disability) but I diligently persist and persevere, why is it not appropriate for my driving instructor to describe me as a persistent [or persevering] learner to differentiate me from those who don't persist (i.e. who give up)?
– Chappo
Jan 1 at 0:09
1
@Chappo: I agree with Johnny. According to Google, "student" is about 20 times more common than "learner". In the US, the standard term for somebody who is learning to drive a car is "student driver".
– Scott
Jan 1 at 1:08
2
Here in Canada, most lay people would use "student" but "learner" was in common use, among educators and educational theorists a while back. It's a useful distinction. A student may be no more than someone occupying a chair in a classroom, while a learner is, by definition learning.
– Al Maki
2 days ago
Johnny, this doesn't answer the question, which is about persistent vs persevering - there's no request for alternatives. It's important to read the question carefully before attempting an answer. For further guidance, see How to Answer. :-)
– Chappo
Dec 31 '18 at 23:35
Johnny, this doesn't answer the question, which is about persistent vs persevering - there's no request for alternatives. It's important to read the question carefully before attempting an answer. For further guidance, see How to Answer. :-)
– Chappo
Dec 31 '18 at 23:35
1
1
Thanks @Chappo I'll check that out. Yeah, I'm answering the bigger implied question and what I think the OP needs to know: "If someone is studying something for a longer period..." And I'd hate to give advice about learner when that's not even idiomatic in the first place, yet we all give the impression that it is.
– Johnny
Dec 31 '18 at 23:38
Thanks @Chappo I'll check that out. Yeah, I'm answering the bigger implied question and what I think the OP needs to know: "If someone is studying something for a longer period..." And I'd hate to give advice about learner when that's not even idiomatic in the first place, yet we all give the impression that it is.
– Johnny
Dec 31 '18 at 23:38
How is learner not "idiomatic". If I'm learning to drive a car, I'm called a learner. If I have some difficulties I must overcome (say, a disability) but I diligently persist and persevere, why is it not appropriate for my driving instructor to describe me as a persistent [or persevering] learner to differentiate me from those who don't persist (i.e. who give up)?
– Chappo
Jan 1 at 0:09
How is learner not "idiomatic". If I'm learning to drive a car, I'm called a learner. If I have some difficulties I must overcome (say, a disability) but I diligently persist and persevere, why is it not appropriate for my driving instructor to describe me as a persistent [or persevering] learner to differentiate me from those who don't persist (i.e. who give up)?
– Chappo
Jan 1 at 0:09
1
1
@Chappo: I agree with Johnny. According to Google, "student" is about 20 times more common than "learner". In the US, the standard term for somebody who is learning to drive a car is "student driver".
– Scott
Jan 1 at 1:08
@Chappo: I agree with Johnny. According to Google, "student" is about 20 times more common than "learner". In the US, the standard term for somebody who is learning to drive a car is "student driver".
– Scott
Jan 1 at 1:08
2
2
Here in Canada, most lay people would use "student" but "learner" was in common use, among educators and educational theorists a while back. It's a useful distinction. A student may be no more than someone occupying a chair in a classroom, while a learner is, by definition learning.
– Al Maki
2 days ago
Here in Canada, most lay people would use "student" but "learner" was in common use, among educators and educational theorists a while back. It's a useful distinction. A student may be no more than someone occupying a chair in a classroom, while a learner is, by definition learning.
– Al Maki
2 days ago
|
show 2 more comments
Between the two options presented, "persistent learner" sounds more natural to me but has some slight connotations that make it less than ideal. In particular, persistence and perseverance when applied to people typically mean "continuing despite adversity". In other words, rather than generally being "somebody who works hard at studying" a persistent learner is specifically "somebody who has a hard time studying but does so anyway", or "somebody who spends a lot of time studying because they need more time to learn the same amount".
If you want to describe someone who studies a lot or works hard at it, the best adjective would be "studious". "Studious learner" is a bit redundant though, if you're combining with a noun like "learner" that already implies that studying is being done then the adjective "diligent" is better, with the best phrase I can think of being "diligent student" assuming that the person is in fact a student.
add a comment |
Between the two options presented, "persistent learner" sounds more natural to me but has some slight connotations that make it less than ideal. In particular, persistence and perseverance when applied to people typically mean "continuing despite adversity". In other words, rather than generally being "somebody who works hard at studying" a persistent learner is specifically "somebody who has a hard time studying but does so anyway", or "somebody who spends a lot of time studying because they need more time to learn the same amount".
If you want to describe someone who studies a lot or works hard at it, the best adjective would be "studious". "Studious learner" is a bit redundant though, if you're combining with a noun like "learner" that already implies that studying is being done then the adjective "diligent" is better, with the best phrase I can think of being "diligent student" assuming that the person is in fact a student.
add a comment |
Between the two options presented, "persistent learner" sounds more natural to me but has some slight connotations that make it less than ideal. In particular, persistence and perseverance when applied to people typically mean "continuing despite adversity". In other words, rather than generally being "somebody who works hard at studying" a persistent learner is specifically "somebody who has a hard time studying but does so anyway", or "somebody who spends a lot of time studying because they need more time to learn the same amount".
If you want to describe someone who studies a lot or works hard at it, the best adjective would be "studious". "Studious learner" is a bit redundant though, if you're combining with a noun like "learner" that already implies that studying is being done then the adjective "diligent" is better, with the best phrase I can think of being "diligent student" assuming that the person is in fact a student.
Between the two options presented, "persistent learner" sounds more natural to me but has some slight connotations that make it less than ideal. In particular, persistence and perseverance when applied to people typically mean "continuing despite adversity". In other words, rather than generally being "somebody who works hard at studying" a persistent learner is specifically "somebody who has a hard time studying but does so anyway", or "somebody who spends a lot of time studying because they need more time to learn the same amount".
If you want to describe someone who studies a lot or works hard at it, the best adjective would be "studious". "Studious learner" is a bit redundant though, if you're combining with a noun like "learner" that already implies that studying is being done then the adjective "diligent" is better, with the best phrase I can think of being "diligent student" assuming that the person is in fact a student.
answered Dec 31 '18 at 15:39
Kamil Drakari
1,127112
1,127112
add a comment |
add a comment |
"Persistent" vs "Perservering" refers to two different kinds of adversity.
"Persistent" is for ordinary adversity, like partying or romantic distractions.
"Perservering" means extraordinary or overwhelming adversity, like oppression or discrimination.
- Santa Cruz has a reputation as a party school, but Kate was a persistent student - never missing a class and carrying a 4.0 average.
- Leads on the case were few and far between, but Hercule Poirot was nothing if not persistent."
- None of the women on the science team were taken seriously - yet they proved to be the better scientists; they had each perservered through worse simply to get here.
- The German doomed their nuclear program, having long decried the science as "Jewish physics", and directing SS inquisitions against those who perservered in its study.
Your explanation makes a lot of sense and the examples are useful, but I'm reluctant to upvote your answer because you've included no evidence to support it - it currently stands as just a personal opinion, and how can we tell if you're misinformed? Can you add some dictionary definitions or other authoritative references to confirm your interpretation? Happy to upvote if you do... :-)
– Chappo
Dec 31 '18 at 23:44
@chappo at your request...
– Harper
Jan 1 at 0:09
According to MW's definition, persevere means "to persist ... in spite of counterinfluences, opposition, or discouragement" - not quite "extraordinary or overwhelming adversity", although the extreme is necessarily part of the range. I think your analysis is correct in its direction but poor in its expression. I'll upvote as promised, but you could garner upvotes from others with a further revision...
– Chappo
Jan 1 at 0:20
add a comment |
"Persistent" vs "Perservering" refers to two different kinds of adversity.
"Persistent" is for ordinary adversity, like partying or romantic distractions.
"Perservering" means extraordinary or overwhelming adversity, like oppression or discrimination.
- Santa Cruz has a reputation as a party school, but Kate was a persistent student - never missing a class and carrying a 4.0 average.
- Leads on the case were few and far between, but Hercule Poirot was nothing if not persistent."
- None of the women on the science team were taken seriously - yet they proved to be the better scientists; they had each perservered through worse simply to get here.
- The German doomed their nuclear program, having long decried the science as "Jewish physics", and directing SS inquisitions against those who perservered in its study.
Your explanation makes a lot of sense and the examples are useful, but I'm reluctant to upvote your answer because you've included no evidence to support it - it currently stands as just a personal opinion, and how can we tell if you're misinformed? Can you add some dictionary definitions or other authoritative references to confirm your interpretation? Happy to upvote if you do... :-)
– Chappo
Dec 31 '18 at 23:44
@chappo at your request...
– Harper
Jan 1 at 0:09
According to MW's definition, persevere means "to persist ... in spite of counterinfluences, opposition, or discouragement" - not quite "extraordinary or overwhelming adversity", although the extreme is necessarily part of the range. I think your analysis is correct in its direction but poor in its expression. I'll upvote as promised, but you could garner upvotes from others with a further revision...
– Chappo
Jan 1 at 0:20
add a comment |
"Persistent" vs "Perservering" refers to two different kinds of adversity.
"Persistent" is for ordinary adversity, like partying or romantic distractions.
"Perservering" means extraordinary or overwhelming adversity, like oppression or discrimination.
- Santa Cruz has a reputation as a party school, but Kate was a persistent student - never missing a class and carrying a 4.0 average.
- Leads on the case were few and far between, but Hercule Poirot was nothing if not persistent."
- None of the women on the science team were taken seriously - yet they proved to be the better scientists; they had each perservered through worse simply to get here.
- The German doomed their nuclear program, having long decried the science as "Jewish physics", and directing SS inquisitions against those who perservered in its study.
"Persistent" vs "Perservering" refers to two different kinds of adversity.
"Persistent" is for ordinary adversity, like partying or romantic distractions.
"Perservering" means extraordinary or overwhelming adversity, like oppression or discrimination.
- Santa Cruz has a reputation as a party school, but Kate was a persistent student - never missing a class and carrying a 4.0 average.
- Leads on the case were few and far between, but Hercule Poirot was nothing if not persistent."
- None of the women on the science team were taken seriously - yet they proved to be the better scientists; they had each perservered through worse simply to get here.
- The German doomed their nuclear program, having long decried the science as "Jewish physics", and directing SS inquisitions against those who perservered in its study.
edited Jan 1 at 0:09
answered Dec 31 '18 at 19:11
Harper
56714
56714
Your explanation makes a lot of sense and the examples are useful, but I'm reluctant to upvote your answer because you've included no evidence to support it - it currently stands as just a personal opinion, and how can we tell if you're misinformed? Can you add some dictionary definitions or other authoritative references to confirm your interpretation? Happy to upvote if you do... :-)
– Chappo
Dec 31 '18 at 23:44
@chappo at your request...
– Harper
Jan 1 at 0:09
According to MW's definition, persevere means "to persist ... in spite of counterinfluences, opposition, or discouragement" - not quite "extraordinary or overwhelming adversity", although the extreme is necessarily part of the range. I think your analysis is correct in its direction but poor in its expression. I'll upvote as promised, but you could garner upvotes from others with a further revision...
– Chappo
Jan 1 at 0:20
add a comment |
Your explanation makes a lot of sense and the examples are useful, but I'm reluctant to upvote your answer because you've included no evidence to support it - it currently stands as just a personal opinion, and how can we tell if you're misinformed? Can you add some dictionary definitions or other authoritative references to confirm your interpretation? Happy to upvote if you do... :-)
– Chappo
Dec 31 '18 at 23:44
@chappo at your request...
– Harper
Jan 1 at 0:09
According to MW's definition, persevere means "to persist ... in spite of counterinfluences, opposition, or discouragement" - not quite "extraordinary or overwhelming adversity", although the extreme is necessarily part of the range. I think your analysis is correct in its direction but poor in its expression. I'll upvote as promised, but you could garner upvotes from others with a further revision...
– Chappo
Jan 1 at 0:20
Your explanation makes a lot of sense and the examples are useful, but I'm reluctant to upvote your answer because you've included no evidence to support it - it currently stands as just a personal opinion, and how can we tell if you're misinformed? Can you add some dictionary definitions or other authoritative references to confirm your interpretation? Happy to upvote if you do... :-)
– Chappo
Dec 31 '18 at 23:44
Your explanation makes a lot of sense and the examples are useful, but I'm reluctant to upvote your answer because you've included no evidence to support it - it currently stands as just a personal opinion, and how can we tell if you're misinformed? Can you add some dictionary definitions or other authoritative references to confirm your interpretation? Happy to upvote if you do... :-)
– Chappo
Dec 31 '18 at 23:44
@chappo at your request...
– Harper
Jan 1 at 0:09
@chappo at your request...
– Harper
Jan 1 at 0:09
According to MW's definition, persevere means "to persist ... in spite of counterinfluences, opposition, or discouragement" - not quite "extraordinary or overwhelming adversity", although the extreme is necessarily part of the range. I think your analysis is correct in its direction but poor in its expression. I'll upvote as promised, but you could garner upvotes from others with a further revision...
– Chappo
Jan 1 at 0:20
According to MW's definition, persevere means "to persist ... in spite of counterinfluences, opposition, or discouragement" - not quite "extraordinary or overwhelming adversity", although the extreme is necessarily part of the range. I think your analysis is correct in its direction but poor in its expression. I'll upvote as promised, but you could garner upvotes from others with a further revision...
– Chappo
Jan 1 at 0:20
add a comment |
Somebody seems to have coined the phrase 'persistent learner', but persistent is normally used when someone keeps on doing something undesirable, like a child pestering a parent for sweets, or in a phrase like 'persistent cough'.
OK, the dictionary definition doesn't specify a negative implication, though an old (1934) edition of the Concise Oxford in my possession defines persist as Continue firmly or obstinately (in opinion, course, doing) esp. against remonstrance &c.
To my way of thinking, you persist in a bad course, persevere in a good one.
So 'persistent learner' can be used in a positive way, even though 'persistent' per se is usually rather negative?
– kalle
Dec 31 '18 at 14:04
4
I would have to disagree your interpretation of 'persistent'. As far as I can tell there's no negative implication to what the person is attempting.
– bxk21
Dec 31 '18 at 14:40
2
-1 I agree with @bxk21 on this one--your definition of persistent being "normally used when someone keeps on doing something undesirable" is simply untrue. Persistent only means that someone is working against opposition, setbacks or failure. Whether that opposition be deserved or not has nothing to do with the word. Perhaps you could edit the answer to include why you believe what you say to be true?
– scohe001
Dec 31 '18 at 17:05
I don't see the connection between "pester" and "persist." Can you provide other negative uses of "persistent"?
– TheFontSnob
Dec 31 '18 at 19:30
I didn't say there was a connection between 'pester' and 'persist', I just used that example of a person being persistent..
– Kate Bunting
2 days ago
add a comment |
Somebody seems to have coined the phrase 'persistent learner', but persistent is normally used when someone keeps on doing something undesirable, like a child pestering a parent for sweets, or in a phrase like 'persistent cough'.
OK, the dictionary definition doesn't specify a negative implication, though an old (1934) edition of the Concise Oxford in my possession defines persist as Continue firmly or obstinately (in opinion, course, doing) esp. against remonstrance &c.
To my way of thinking, you persist in a bad course, persevere in a good one.
So 'persistent learner' can be used in a positive way, even though 'persistent' per se is usually rather negative?
– kalle
Dec 31 '18 at 14:04
4
I would have to disagree your interpretation of 'persistent'. As far as I can tell there's no negative implication to what the person is attempting.
– bxk21
Dec 31 '18 at 14:40
2
-1 I agree with @bxk21 on this one--your definition of persistent being "normally used when someone keeps on doing something undesirable" is simply untrue. Persistent only means that someone is working against opposition, setbacks or failure. Whether that opposition be deserved or not has nothing to do with the word. Perhaps you could edit the answer to include why you believe what you say to be true?
– scohe001
Dec 31 '18 at 17:05
I don't see the connection between "pester" and "persist." Can you provide other negative uses of "persistent"?
– TheFontSnob
Dec 31 '18 at 19:30
I didn't say there was a connection between 'pester' and 'persist', I just used that example of a person being persistent..
– Kate Bunting
2 days ago
add a comment |
Somebody seems to have coined the phrase 'persistent learner', but persistent is normally used when someone keeps on doing something undesirable, like a child pestering a parent for sweets, or in a phrase like 'persistent cough'.
OK, the dictionary definition doesn't specify a negative implication, though an old (1934) edition of the Concise Oxford in my possession defines persist as Continue firmly or obstinately (in opinion, course, doing) esp. against remonstrance &c.
To my way of thinking, you persist in a bad course, persevere in a good one.
Somebody seems to have coined the phrase 'persistent learner', but persistent is normally used when someone keeps on doing something undesirable, like a child pestering a parent for sweets, or in a phrase like 'persistent cough'.
OK, the dictionary definition doesn't specify a negative implication, though an old (1934) edition of the Concise Oxford in my possession defines persist as Continue firmly or obstinately (in opinion, course, doing) esp. against remonstrance &c.
To my way of thinking, you persist in a bad course, persevere in a good one.
edited 2 days ago
answered Dec 31 '18 at 13:22
Kate Bunting
5,75831417
5,75831417
So 'persistent learner' can be used in a positive way, even though 'persistent' per se is usually rather negative?
– kalle
Dec 31 '18 at 14:04
4
I would have to disagree your interpretation of 'persistent'. As far as I can tell there's no negative implication to what the person is attempting.
– bxk21
Dec 31 '18 at 14:40
2
-1 I agree with @bxk21 on this one--your definition of persistent being "normally used when someone keeps on doing something undesirable" is simply untrue. Persistent only means that someone is working against opposition, setbacks or failure. Whether that opposition be deserved or not has nothing to do with the word. Perhaps you could edit the answer to include why you believe what you say to be true?
– scohe001
Dec 31 '18 at 17:05
I don't see the connection between "pester" and "persist." Can you provide other negative uses of "persistent"?
– TheFontSnob
Dec 31 '18 at 19:30
I didn't say there was a connection between 'pester' and 'persist', I just used that example of a person being persistent..
– Kate Bunting
2 days ago
add a comment |
So 'persistent learner' can be used in a positive way, even though 'persistent' per se is usually rather negative?
– kalle
Dec 31 '18 at 14:04
4
I would have to disagree your interpretation of 'persistent'. As far as I can tell there's no negative implication to what the person is attempting.
– bxk21
Dec 31 '18 at 14:40
2
-1 I agree with @bxk21 on this one--your definition of persistent being "normally used when someone keeps on doing something undesirable" is simply untrue. Persistent only means that someone is working against opposition, setbacks or failure. Whether that opposition be deserved or not has nothing to do with the word. Perhaps you could edit the answer to include why you believe what you say to be true?
– scohe001
Dec 31 '18 at 17:05
I don't see the connection between "pester" and "persist." Can you provide other negative uses of "persistent"?
– TheFontSnob
Dec 31 '18 at 19:30
I didn't say there was a connection between 'pester' and 'persist', I just used that example of a person being persistent..
– Kate Bunting
2 days ago
So 'persistent learner' can be used in a positive way, even though 'persistent' per se is usually rather negative?
– kalle
Dec 31 '18 at 14:04
So 'persistent learner' can be used in a positive way, even though 'persistent' per se is usually rather negative?
– kalle
Dec 31 '18 at 14:04
4
4
I would have to disagree your interpretation of 'persistent'. As far as I can tell there's no negative implication to what the person is attempting.
– bxk21
Dec 31 '18 at 14:40
I would have to disagree your interpretation of 'persistent'. As far as I can tell there's no negative implication to what the person is attempting.
– bxk21
Dec 31 '18 at 14:40
2
2
-1 I agree with @bxk21 on this one--your definition of persistent being "normally used when someone keeps on doing something undesirable" is simply untrue. Persistent only means that someone is working against opposition, setbacks or failure. Whether that opposition be deserved or not has nothing to do with the word. Perhaps you could edit the answer to include why you believe what you say to be true?
– scohe001
Dec 31 '18 at 17:05
-1 I agree with @bxk21 on this one--your definition of persistent being "normally used when someone keeps on doing something undesirable" is simply untrue. Persistent only means that someone is working against opposition, setbacks or failure. Whether that opposition be deserved or not has nothing to do with the word. Perhaps you could edit the answer to include why you believe what you say to be true?
– scohe001
Dec 31 '18 at 17:05
I don't see the connection between "pester" and "persist." Can you provide other negative uses of "persistent"?
– TheFontSnob
Dec 31 '18 at 19:30
I don't see the connection between "pester" and "persist." Can you provide other negative uses of "persistent"?
– TheFontSnob
Dec 31 '18 at 19:30
I didn't say there was a connection between 'pester' and 'persist', I just used that example of a person being persistent..
– Kate Bunting
2 days ago
I didn't say there was a connection between 'pester' and 'persist', I just used that example of a person being persistent..
– Kate Bunting
2 days ago
add a comment |
kalle is a new contributor. Be nice, and check out our Code of Conduct.
kalle is a new contributor. Be nice, and check out our Code of Conduct.
kalle is a new contributor. Be nice, and check out our Code of Conduct.
kalle is a new contributor. Be nice, and check out our Code of Conduct.
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Related: Difference between “persistence” and “perseverance"
– scohe001
Dec 31 '18 at 17:27